Will 8% Rates Kill Home Sales? feat. Stephen Marx and Sean Deminski

[00:00:00] This is the Chester County Real Estate Podcast. Bring in you the info you need to make your next move a great one.

[00:00:30] What's what the market is doing. So I want that on the ground hands on from the front lines approach. This is honestly, I love it when we can just talk about what people who, what agents are seeing.

[00:00:43] I guess real stories from the front line basically. So we're hitting it's early October 2023 and I think the biggest news is interest rates right?

[00:00:54] Yeah. Are you seeing, so right now we just saw the interest rates jump up a little bit a lot like what are you looking at right now?

[00:01:02] They're pretty much right around 8%. And being from a listing agent's perspective, you know that's mainly whether that's last three months that's been 90% of my business and listings.

[00:01:15] We are seeing stuff sell a little bit slow. A little bit slower is the best way to put it, you know days on markets going up. People are definitely being peculiar with what they spend.

[00:01:25] It is one it is you know it's no longer days of five six percent interest rates and one meter five six percent interest rates people were saying oh it's no longer the days of three percent interest rates right but you know the truth three out is you know is this is 8% you know that's where the national average was for the past 30 years or so.

[00:01:41] So it's it's you know things are selling slower. So like are you seeing things like they're getting picky buyers are getting picky about things that are seemingly not related that you think might be to get website.

[00:01:55] Yeah, no 100% I mean I think people are like they're and I said that he the expression cold feet.

[00:02:01] Yeah, but they were getting that a little bit easier with something you know like there it's it's always been a big lump sum of money that they're putting towards what's buying a property.

[00:02:09] But back when you know the interest rates were lower the market was a little hotter days they felt like oh you know maybe one or this thing or that thing I can kind of always fix later change later whatever may be so I think people right now are looking for a lot more of like that deal or that 100% moving ready you don't have to do anything.

[00:02:27] Yeah, no more the days of buying like that light fixer upper that like you know is moving ready but you know you might need to paint the walls and do some of that stuff like people are just getting picky.

[00:02:37] It's kind of what I've realized you know like I have a listing in downtown and it's a beautiful listing you know it's great kind of you know firstly read down as some spots and you know there's there's stuff here and there you know the kitchen still yellow stuff like that and.

[00:02:52] You know it's we've had a good amount of action. We've had a lot of shelings and by the amount of shelings we've had by statistic numbers of what I've seen in pastless things.

[00:02:59] I should have gotten about one or two offers by now. You know but with the feedback we've had a adjust you know do a little price reduction and kind of you know.

[00:03:08] Worker we're going the method of offering a sellers is just now to help with closing costs just so you know really show like hey like guys we're here to sell the property that's what we want to do.

[00:03:19] And to a buyer's perspective you know if they're seeing that we're offering the closing costs they might might say hey you know like it's less money out of my pocket.

[00:03:28] All right and more money that we can put towards you know that difference of what you know the seven eight percent is your favorite would be. So a couple questions on that one the feedback that you're getting is it.

[00:03:41] Is it objective like I guess what I'm saying is it objective feedback or is it subjective feedback as far as their objections go is it you know what it needs too much work the kitchen is too old we don't like the location or are you getting more like it doesn't.

[00:03:57] Or like it doesn't feel right it's not for them they they just don't really like it once they saw it like and have you seen that kind of have you seen that shift at all in the last year or so I like the market has shifted.

[00:04:11] Yes, I think now we're more towards like in the middle phase because I've gotten both types of feedback on this property. I've gotten feedback where it's like hey you know my clients didn't surprise us a little high you know I've called them say you know.

[00:04:22] What about it you know made writing that and then you know there's also the type of feedback that I'm beginning where it's like. You know people are just saying hey you know the rooms too small for me.

[00:04:34] You know just it's not going to work for my my scenario what I need and you know that's completely understandable not every homes for everybody out there you know if I was buying a home of my my my my house that's too small for my family I'm not going to buy something that's.

[00:04:47] You know right not right for my family so you know that that's a big feedbacks understandable but I think now we're kind of in that middle phase you know it's no longer like. Like back six months ago the only criticism you got was.

[00:05:02] Hey guys just you know it's not big enough my family a little it's not right for the situation. You know I want to see prices not necessarily an issue back then but back when you know.

[00:05:13] The mortgage payment of 300,000 dollars houses it's close into a mortgage payment of a 500,000 dollars house now. You know people are getting a little more has that is that when we're looking at.

[00:05:30] Yeah I mean I don't know the exact number is a time of head but like if you go back to like 20 21 numbers compared to like today.

[00:05:39] The purchasing power of like people that were buying like five to six hundred hours in our homes like they're in the mid fours now. Okay just because that industry does doubled. I'm almost tripled in an extent.

[00:05:50] Well I mean eight I don't know if it's has it I don't know if it's triple I mean it's definitely doubled since what like less three or four years.

[00:05:58] Yeah initially we're looking at how like interest rates in the what fours three so when I first got into real estate a little bit like two and a half years ago. Yeah interest rates were at two and a half percent okay.

[00:06:10] And I remember that because it was like when I first started it was like a rarerace. Like it was like what was a frenzy yeah every every listing was just like a frenzy and and that's kind of why I'm curious on what the feedback is because.

[00:06:23] It feels like sentiment has changed and motivation has changed whereas you're not seeing that like oh we have to buy something as soon as possible anything in any condition.

[00:06:33] Obviously that's going to change but the first thing you're going to do is you're going to see people start to lose their like enthusiasm.

[00:06:41] And then they'll come you know like they're not going to come out and be like oh well if if if you include this isn't this you know and that's where an agent does come in here you know that is where an agent does come in place someone to go back and be like okay.

[00:06:56] What is it that doesn't work for them how can we look at this differently how can we shift us around how can we negotiate.

[00:07:02] But yeah like so I didn't mean to cut you off but back when it was low people it was that we're frenzy and it was very. I don't want to say easy because I had its own set of set of challenges but things were just flying really quickly.

[00:07:17] Yeah yeah no I mean we were we were putting it off or just like 30 to 50 grand above asking price like and even price and you like me in the most of it was more towards like way of the inspections and stuff like that.

[00:07:28] I mean now you're seeing stuff kind of sit at asking price a little bit more it's still selling I don't know say like we're like a complete stance little in the market you know stuff still selling it just is now it's more towards finding that.

[00:07:40] Right by our first scenario compared to what it was before where it was like there was 80 right by right right right and I feel like there's I am I am seeing a lot more feedback too like there's a lot of people that did buy back in 2021 they're like that kind of wish I like.

[00:07:56] Almost waited to find a different home and didn't just like rush into this one because it was like one I can get right you know and I mean I'm not necessarily like saying like oh they're coming back to me and they're saying like even you know like they're.

[00:08:08] You know I didn't throw anybody into a home I always asked them you know he's just something you really want to do like you know.

[00:08:14] Look at the numbers I more than happy to show you a property you know you know it just you know like there's a big difference between.

[00:08:22] What we were seeing you know I remember going to showings and as you're in that showing there's four other people there yeah like you're talking 50 plus showing in two days.

[00:08:32] Well you know and I always kind of reminded people I'm like the market it's good as they say I prefer a buyer's market. You know better for investors first time home buyers like to people I care about.

[00:08:47] I care about the elements too the but it's good but it wasn't it wasn't healthy and I kind of like everything I told people I was like look everyone's trying to get in the same direction it's like a traffic jam everyone's going to the same place but no one can get there.

[00:09:00] And it didn't it didn't feel like a healthy market and there were some people who were all all out like. They said it was dangerous particularly the home specters because they're like hey everyone's waving inspections this is going to come back to bite them.

[00:09:14] Personally I feel like it depends on the property and the buyer but you know I didn't it didn't feel healthy to me and you know I would go and show a house and be like hey guys by the way you have about.

[00:09:25] Let's say an hour to make the next biggest decision of your life so let me know and it has nothing to do with like trying to get you guys to like close the deal it's just letting you know in a couple hours they're going to probably accept an offer over asking and.

[00:09:41] You know could be better or worse in years so. It was it was really it was frustrating for me as an agent it was frustrating for buyers and honestly it wasn't like the sellers were really I mean it was nice the extra money was nice but they.

[00:09:55] They were being indated they couldn't really make a good decision necessarily but yeah it was just it I it was good but I didn't like it honestly I didn't it didn't feel like a healthy market if like a frenzy a buying frenzy and I'm even like saying bubble or anything like that.

[00:10:13] I don't even know if prices have been affected that much but I mean they've leveled off a little bit but I just didn't like it I like it when a buyer has some time to make a good decision and the seller has some time and some motivation to work with that buyer to make it a good deal.

[00:10:35] And that was just not the case for a little while back there you know yeah I mean I think now like. The market we're seeing now is the market that I was always looking forward to.

[00:10:44] It makes sense you know like I got to real estate because you know I wanted to be a meet people and. And you go along with that direction when I first started you couldn't even make a connection with a client you know it was just like.

[00:10:54] Yeah I mentioned my first time off the visit call off like 10 minutes ago and we're going to spend an offer now so.

[00:11:00] You know I'll see a settlement right that's the towel was it was not even like you know now taking clients out to coffee you know actually meeting up talking about like building their five to seven year plan or whatever it may be.

[00:11:10] Like we're actually putting systems in place so they can like. I'm you know not just that I wasn't doing this before but this way it's easier for them to get ahead and like they're actually putting a housing strategy is what I had to call it.

[00:11:22] You know in place so it makes it makes it very.

[00:11:25] You know it's a very different market per se but like the market now is definitely more personable it's definitely more you know you're able to kind of get what you want you know I love this thing of like all things in real estate or negotiable.

[00:11:38] I don't realize that you know people see the asking price and the one like what's the asking price like can't go below that but right you know now you're in a market where you.

[00:11:45] You can offer blow asking you know I mean I back in 2020 I got like two offers except the blow asking you know it just really depends on how you like you know how your agents.

[00:11:55] Looking at the property how they're actually able to evaluate some stuff you know things like that I mean it comes down to what the property is worth yeah I mean honestly.

[00:12:04] It's something is listed and I try to remind people because you can you'll get these properties are listed way below ask or way below market and they're just doing it to it's just strategy to generate a frenzy to try to get some an momentum.

[00:12:18] Sam, God and, sometimes it works I think it depends on the property and then you have the ones that are way away overpriced.

[00:12:26] And honestly the ones that are overpriced they're you know I I think someone who's been in the industry for a couple years can start to say like hey yeah.

[00:12:34] That that's a cool house yeah that there's a lot of money it's not going to go for that or you look at the listing been like you know you get that like oh we have to see this today it's so cheap.

[00:12:42] it's not going to go for that. They're going to go over. So, it's not, I mean really, it just depends on the price and the listing on whether or not it's going to go over under asking,

[00:12:51] asking is just kind of a baseline to communicate, to get you, to pin a price to that number. Now, technically, if you do offer clean deal for that amount, they really should take it. So

[00:13:08] I think there's ethical issues in there. I don't want to get too into that. I have her stories of them, you know, an offer being made and then I'm thinking they can get more

[00:13:17] and then the seller doesn't take the offer. I'm not sure how all that works. But it means something but it's also there just to kind of peg the value to the property to start in the negotiations.

[00:13:31] So, I mean, one thing I've noticed is that there's a, there's agents that kind of, you go either way with it. You know, there's one local team near us and I've noticed a lot of his

[00:13:41] listings. He likes to just, you know, like you said, do the strategy of below market and create the hype and engineering business that way. You know, I've always been a guy that's

[00:13:50] put it at market value of what I see it as. You know, so I run my comps and I say, you know, we're going to be in the medium price range with it. And I think that's always, in my head,

[00:14:00] that's always been the safest strategy because I know my clients aren't necessarily going to be leaving money on that table. But they're also not going to be, you know, over stress and over,

[00:14:09] over where to buy certain things. Now, creating like that buyer, you know, mass flux the frenzy like you're talking about, it's always a good strategy but it can be, you know, getting risky because

[00:14:20] what if what does that frenzy doesn't happen? And then you just listed this house at below market value and it sits on the market for, you know, a week or two. Yeah. And you don't get the multiple

[00:14:29] offers and then you get a market, you know, an offer at asking price when that same person was probably willing to actually pay a market value for that home. Yeah. You know, what I've had,

[00:14:38] I've had a blown up my face. I can think of at least one listing I had where we went in, I thought it was fairly low. But it was just a high demand area, high demand type of listing.

[00:14:51] And I had an open house and someone ran through the house and told me he gave me his card because we're going to have an offer for you within the next day or two. Like, all right. So he,

[00:15:02] he gives me the offer. It's pretty standard. It's got like a seven day home inspection contingency. Like, okay, so I presented to my seller and he's like, look, looks good. Like it looks good. We

[00:15:15] accept the offer. Come to find out that the, you know, I think we could have done a little bit more digging to do to figure this out. But it was kind of one of those like frenzy situations. The guy who sent

[00:15:30] the offer was just the agent and the actual, it was an investor situation. And the investor has not seen the property. The home inspection was when the investor was going to actually see

[00:15:39] the property. And I didn't really understand what was going on at first. I don't know, you know, we'd have, that's the down talk with the broker and stuff to find out what options there work.

[00:15:50] Because if someone had you in offer, you kind of have to present it to the seller and you can kind of give them like a heads up. Like, hey, this is like the dating goes, they didn't actually see

[00:16:00] the property yet. Anyway, bottom line is the investor comes here to come to the property. You know, napkin math says, Nath's not going to work for us and backs out. So now I lost all that momentum

[00:16:13] from the open house, all those other people who were interested who then saw go under contract. And then now I have to put it back on the MLS and that's in the history that I took it off and

[00:16:23] then put it back on. So now when you bring your buyer, you're like, hey, Sean, why was this taken off the market and then and then put back on? I'm going to tell us, I'm going to be as truthful as

[00:16:33] possible. I'm going to be like, hey, you know, we had we had an offer. It didn't work out. They backed out. Um, can you tell me why they backed out? It was on a home inspection. And can't say,

[00:16:41] it wasn't quite what they were looking for. Um, but, you know, now they're asking questions. They're what's wrong with the property. Why did they back out? And now I'm telling this line here,

[00:16:53] something that I really should never have had to like worry about. So, you know, and I've talked to other people about this. Like no, the buyer has to look see the property before I accept an offer.

[00:17:06] But my whole point there is just kind of pointing out that like when you're in this like frenzy, and there's like a huge amount of demand, it's not necessarily good for the seller.

[00:17:15] You know, things can happen. Things can, you know, slip through to cracks almost or say would we like, I don't know if you if you agree with that. But, you know, just because there's a lot of

[00:17:27] people getting a large amount of money doesn't necessarily mean it's good for the seller and that they're going to come out ahead in every single search or situation. Yeah, I mean we've we saw

[00:17:37] that definitely a good bit as far as like, you know, from even from the buyer end, you still got like the like if you dig it at home in inspection because it's the accepted,

[00:17:48] like I noticed that the listing agents when I first started they were very on edge. Like they were very overwhelmed per se. Yeah, that's why to put it. You know, so like my, my first deal ever was

[00:18:00] under home in specialties agency and we backed out and the agent wasn't going to happy about it. Right. You know, it's like, it's like, you know, hey, you're the ones that decided to go with our

[00:18:12] right. You told us to get us highest and best. We gave you the highest offer we could. You know, that's what we did. But you probably had through their offers that didn't have a home

[00:18:19] inspection agency on it. But you saw that five extra grand that was on the table or something like that. And that's what you went with. Well, a lot of it's the sellers, the sellers choose which offer

[00:18:31] to accept. Yeah. And that's why also people are like, what's what's an agent actually? You know, I've heard people like, what's a real estate agent actually do? How many times did you spend? I'm like,

[00:18:41] I don't know that like you don't know when your real estate agent just saves you 100,000. You know, a couple of a hundred thousand dollars because they didn't, they, they, they advise you not

[00:18:51] to take the wrong offer or something like that. You know, but you had someone there to kind of talk about this and negotiate this, get the deal done. You know, people are like, oh, you spend what,

[00:19:01] like an hour on the phone and then you make all this money. And it's like maybe possible or maybe we spend months working with someone and we don't make any money. So, you know,

[00:19:12] how what would you do then? So I mean there's a lot of times I go into listings and I'm like literally cleaning the house as like the photographers there. Yeah. Like whatever, maybe like

[00:19:20] sort of sort of situations like that. I mean if it's vacant, you know, like I've had cobwebs in the corner and it's like like, like, you know, like there's, there's a lot of other stuff that goes on that,

[00:19:29] you know, behind the scenes, you know, I've painted walls and stuff like that for clients. I've done certain things like that, you know. Is that a, is that an offer? No. It's kidding. I mean,

[00:19:38] hey, everything's negotiable. But no, it's like, it's like one of those things where like, I think that's what really makes a good agent to compare to a bad agent. Like if you get

[00:19:47] done selling your home and you don't feel like your agent was worth the money, you know, well, they didn't, they didn't that agent didn't do enough. Yeah. Or it's possible that if you got,

[00:19:59] if you got done selling the house and the agent made it look easy and felt like it wasn't worth the money, maybe he was doing his job. Maybe that's exactly his job. His or her job. If an agent's

[00:20:09] constantly coming up with like issues and there's always fires to put out, like maybe that's, maybe that's not a great agent, you know? And I don't want to like knock any agents here or anything

[00:20:18] like that. But a lot of times agents will create drama to be the hero. I don't want to say a lot. It happened. So, you know, and then you're like, oh man, it's so great. She takes care of things. But

[00:20:30] honestly, no, like the drama thirp free easy sale is what the agent is supposed to be providing. So there is an element where it's like if you feel like you're overpaying, it's like,

[00:20:40] maybe it's because they did their job almost too well. Yeah. It was too easy. It made it look easy. That's that's like, he's like my my goal, my monitor is always to make like, hey,

[00:20:52] make this move as stress-free as possible. Right. You know, like I help out budget trucks, whatever, maybe I help with the moving situation. Like from the whole line of your art, start to finish, I try to make this stress free as possible. And like so for me, like,

[00:21:05] I'm always kind of you know, keeping contact with you over a single day like that type of situation. And you know, I've never personally had somebody come up to me and say like, yeah, it's not

[00:21:13] worth a money like pay you like, right, kind of situation. So like, when I do hear people say like, like real estate agents, like jobs are like useless. Yeah. In a situation in a sense,

[00:21:24] all sometimes agree with them. Right. You know, I'll say, hey, like in reality, like, yes, you can go out and hire an attorney to do everything that I'm doing. You can go out and do this.

[00:21:33] But like, you know, the statistics, you know, like, am I head like, why wouldn't you use a buyer's agent? Right. Like, why am I going to why, why as a buyer am I going to go out of my way and pay an attorney?

[00:21:44] When a buyer's agent is free for the buyer, like the dick and soon, you know what I'm going to say? Like to me that doesn't make any sense. Like why am I going to pay an attorney

[00:21:53] to do a job that like literally somebody is certified to do? I have either license, that states that I'm allowed to write a group of sales in the state of Pennsylvania, that I'm allowed to represent buyers. Right. Yeah. Even on the seller side too, I mean,

[00:22:10] why would you not list it with an agent? Like I get negotiating maybe 6% or whatever is a little higher, you know, you can handle some of the other costs or because they're their agents who will just

[00:22:20] pass like, they'll take full full commission and then pass every single cost onto those seller and interesting strategy. But even then, it's like compared to like putting a freaking for sale by owner

[00:22:31] signing your yard. Like if you drive down the road and you see a for sale by owner sign, the first thing you're thinking is how am I going to start negotiating with this person?

[00:22:40] Did get how am I going to get this person down so it was possible? If you see it listed with something like a remax sign, you're like, oh okay, this person's being represented by an agent.

[00:22:49] And I don't know, like I don't know how you can like, there's no data. I mean, there's some data. I don't believe that data on there because I think he's just one of those things where it's like

[00:22:58] every situation is different. It's like when people give like dating advice and they're like, oh girls really like this, or guys really like that. And you're like, really? Like I think it kind of depends on the individual and the individual situation. But yeah, with like real estate,

[00:23:12] I'm like why would you want like, like, what do you think someone's like, how do you you're opening up the conversation with a for sale by owner sign from Home Depot? And you think you're going to get to say them out for your house? Yeah. Well, I mean,

[00:23:24] like again, there's like there's bright MLS studies. There's like realtor.com's. Like if you search out, like four sale by owner versus like listing with a reader or any of them. Like I just kidding.

[00:23:34] If you search some of them, like on average, there's a lot of them, but you say it's like 17 to 20% is what you're leaving on the table. And you look at the head and you're like, how does that number

[00:23:42] like come out? Like how do I, how do I, as a, you know, first sale by owner, like how do I get 17% less? You know, and like you said though, make sense. You're going to home to the phone. You're buying

[00:23:52] that 97% you know, first sale by owner sign. You're most likely paying somebody like one of one of them listed services on the MLS, you're paying them for the 700 bucks whatever maybe.

[00:24:03] And then you're just like they're going to get this first to sell out. Okay? So how is that 17% coming to play? Well, you're no longer scheduling up your own showings on showing time. You're doing

[00:24:12] it like manually by a phone and like all those other stuff. And most people know sense are going to go out of their way to just give you a random phone call. They're going to text their agent

[00:24:21] and if you're getting bombarded with all this stuff, if you miss one opportunity, there's one opportunity to mistrate there. Same situation. It was like the marketing material and all other stuff. You know, most likely I've seen a lot of for yourself by owners not get professional photography.

[00:24:32] They're just taking pictures all their iPhone. No sense. That doesn't do well with like algorithms and disbursement and different things like that. Right. You know, you're not running the targeted Facebook ads that like my company alone has spent thousands of dollars, like trying to narrow down

[00:24:48] and find the right consumer. You know, different things like that is like stuff like this adds up. Like there's a reason why like when you go to buy, what's a good example? I always use catch up.

[00:25:02] Yeah, catch up examples. So like you have you have the name and name like Heinz Brand, catch up right. And then you got like you own the wagons and you got like the name brand at the top

[00:25:12] and then won the bottom shelf. You have like the store brand, right? And there are people who will always just buy the store brand. But there's also people who just always buy the name brand.

[00:25:23] But I'll tell you what, if they were the same price, no one's going to buy the store brand. Like there has to be a price difference if all things being equal. Because half the time we,

[00:25:32] you know, people know it's made in the same factory. Like it's all coming from the same place. It's all the same catch up. But you know like, like if you no one's going to buy that that bottom shelf

[00:25:42] brand, if it's not, if it's the same price as the top shelf. Just isn't going to happen. So the idea that people are going to spend the same amount of money for a house with a home depot sign,

[00:25:54] not the home depot's a bad brand. But like the force out by owner sign, I just find it hard to believe. And I just feel like if you extrapolate the data out far enough, everyone has their friend or

[00:26:02] neighbor who was able to do it some different way all turn of way and it might have worked out for him. What you don't know is the friend or neighbor who it didn't work out for him. And just so

[00:26:11] happening, they don't go around talking about it. People don't like to repeat their failures over and over again. They yes, it sounds like everyone's got to is getting all these wins when you're

[00:26:21] hanging out at the cookout. But that's just because people don't talk about like, oh yeah, I made this dumb mistake. And let me talk to you about it over and over again. Like no, it's going to be like,

[00:26:30] oh yeah, I say two grand by buying this car off of Craigslist. Everyone should go to Craigslist, you know, like, and it's like, well, maybe that's a good way to buy a car, but not for everybody.

[00:26:39] And you've literally told that story five times. You don't have five different stories. So, sorry, that's a little bit of a rant right there. Well, it means the same concept. Like, you know, you can put it like, like good luck, apparently like for such a year, whatever

[00:26:51] maybe. Yeah, right. You know, there's a lot of people that are only shopped at like the premiere outlets and like only get the name brand stuff like you just said with the ketchup example.

[00:26:59] And I think that's the perfect example for it is it's just like, you know, these brands spent years and years and millions of dollars on marketing and different sorts of adventures

[00:27:12] to get their name out there and to build, you know, a company in a brand versus, you know, like, just say like a garage sale. Right. That only happens once and you're not, you know, no offense. If somebody that's actually like known for marketing auctions and it's like,

[00:27:31] and the state sales puts out a sign, they're going to get 100 people there. Right. You put it aside on the corner for your garage sale. You might get 10. Right. You know, a little surprise.

[00:27:43] You always struck me as a cool guy. But you know, like that's that's, that's, you know, it comes down to it. Like, like, I can throw my house on zillog just how anybody else can,

[00:27:56] you know, I can go type of my address and just say, look for sale and yeah, I'll get in front of somebody but it's not going to speed the algorithm. Like, you're not like all these other agents out there

[00:28:05] where they're paying the little thousands of dollars per a month so they can appear on their more times. Yeah. You know, so they can do something with the algorithms and all that other stuff. So I hear you,

[00:28:14] man. By cool. Well, I think that's, I think that's pretty cool. Pretty good. I think it gives people an idea where we're at with the market right now. Hopefully, where what's the good way for people to

[00:28:24] get in touch with you. Give me a call for it for eight, eight, three, is your nine, two, eight. I can't reach me through there. My social media is our pretty much Stephen Mark's underscore. Yeah. Awesome. Stephen Mark's underscore for Instagram that Facebook's just Stephen Mark's. Awesome.

[00:28:39] Cool. All right, man. Well, thanks a lot. Thanks for joining me. Thanks for having me shown. Guys, hey, if you like this interview and you want to check out more head over to our YouTube channel at

[00:28:47] RemaxaseReality or you can check us out at Chester CountyPodcast.com. We got more episodes and shows there. Leave a like and a subscribe if you like this and I'll see you then. This is on Facebook, YouTube and wherever podcasts are found.